KV6 Water Pump

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mjc9967
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KV6 Water Pump

Post by mjc9967 » Mon Nov 14, 2016 5:25 pm

Hi All,

Don't suppose anyone's got (or knows where there is) a NEW water pump for an 825 KV6?

Just having my MK2 Sterling timing belts redone etc (that was a quick 8yrs!), so having water pump renewed at same time. It turns out that the alleged superceding part (as fitted to 75's and Land Rovers from 99 on) is not quite as identical as it should be...
Mark

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Re: KV6 Water Pump

Post by scoobyh123 » Mon Nov 14, 2016 8:29 pm

mjc9967 wrote:Hi All,

Don't suppose anyone's got (or knows where there is) a NEW water pump for an 825 KV6?
That sounds like a fair swap Mark! :wink: :lol:

I take it you mean the original spec water pump rather than anything upgraded/uprated/updated?
Daft question but have you tried Rimmers? What about fleabay? Also Kia dealers - the Sedona (think it was the Sedona) used the 2.5 KV6 as well and i'm fairly sure it was the 800 spec engine.

Another thought - could it be that the water pump you already have is just a poor copy?
Cheers,
Dave

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Re: KV6 Water Pump

Post by dollysprint » Mon Nov 14, 2016 8:40 pm

Sorry Mark can't help with the KV6 water pump but I do remember this subject came up a while back and they were incredibly difficult to source as the guy at the time just kept getting sent the later 75 version, which if memory serves had one of the bolt holes in a slightly different place

Dave
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Re: KV6 Water Pump

Post by traineefarmer » Mon Nov 14, 2016 9:58 pm

I'm not clear on the differences, but it must be possible to adapt the new style part. Have you got some pictures, we may be able to help.
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Re: KV6 Water Pump

Post by thamestyres » Tue Nov 15, 2016 8:40 pm

the kia Sedona also uses the kv6 engine and the water pump is the same as the 800.... the 75 pump has a couple of the bolt holes in a different place.. I have used the Sedona pump, and it is spot on... should be available at any good parts supplier..

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/New-OEM-QUALI ... SwnbZYJYvf

hers one I found on ebay... regards ricky
Rover Sterling KV6 V.reg 4 tailpipes and rs5 wheels (sold) :shock:
home of the "Mad Maestro"
1935 morris 18/6, having a near end of life rejuvenation, xj6 running gear..

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Re: KV6 Water Pump

Post by scoobyh123 » Tue Nov 15, 2016 9:04 pm

There you go Mark - two votes for the Kia water pump so go and rob a Kia dealer! Errr, order a water pump from them even! :wink: :D
Cheers,
Dave

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Re: KV6 Water Pump

Post by mjc9967 » Wed Nov 16, 2016 3:13 am

Thanks for all the replies guys!

As has been mentioned by others my garage keeps ordering the correct part no but getting R75 pumps, which do not fit due to different bolt hole positions.

They have tried sending my old one away together with the new one in the hope that new innards can be grafted into my old casing, but no go there either. Have also been told unable to refurbish old pump.

Thanks for the Kia idea, I will follow that up! Fingers crossed!
Mark

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Re: KV6 Water Pump

Post by scoobyh123 » Wed Nov 16, 2016 4:19 pm

Good luck Mark - fingers crossed for you! :wink: :D
Cheers,
Dave

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Re: KV6 Water Pump

Post by mjc9967 » Wed Nov 23, 2016 10:52 am

Good news - this has worked!!!

Have got a couple more new ones in for the future. The one that was removed was original from new as far as we can tell (I got the car at 4.5yrs old with 20k miles), so thats 17yrs service for that part. Am thinking possibly this might get changed every 2nd timing belt change, belts get done every 8yrs. The original part had not failed but was "notchy" and had some resistance to being turned, so thought it prudent to change now. Will keep that one too in case it becomes possible to recondition.

Thanks ever so much for the brilliant steer guys (esp Ricky and Dave) - I really was not comfortable thinking about turning fixing holes into slots and making a new hole in the engine block to accommodate the R75 part!

Next thought arising from this: can anyone think of any other later R75 KV6 engine parts that are not quite right for the R800 spec engine?
Mark

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Re: KV6 Water Pump

Post by scoobyh123 » Wed Nov 23, 2016 3:17 pm

mjc9967 wrote:Good news - this has worked!!!

Have got a couple more new ones in for the future. The one that was removed was original from new as far as we can tell (I got the car at 4.5yrs old with 20k miles), so thats 17yrs service for that part. Am thinking possibly this might get changed every 2nd timing belt change, belts get done every 8yrs. The original part had not failed but was "notchy" and had some resistance to being turned, so thought it prudent to change now. Will keep that one too in case it becomes possible to recondition.

Thanks ever so much for the brilliant steer guys (esp Ricky and Dave) - I really was not comfortable thinking about turning fixing holes into slots and making a new hole in the engine block to accommodate the R75 part!

Next thought arising from this: can anyone think of any other later R75 KV6 engine parts that are not quite right for the R800 spec engine?
Glad you got sorted Mark! Usually if a timing belt is changed, it's common practice to change the water pump as a precaution as it's a lot cheaper to do it while the engine is already half stripped and not after it's bent a few valves. Most garages won't guarantee their work if they've recommended you change the water pump and you haven't done it, depends whether you are doing the job yourself or getting it done somewhere really.

As for the 75 KV6 parts that won't fit an 800 KV6, i'd say most things from the sump to the head gasket and everything from the head gasket up! :P :lol:
That said there's many a true word spoken in jest as the saying goes, i know a lot of KV6 75s don't have a sump drain plug whereas the 800s did. If the water pump has been modified, it suggests BMW went to town on the engine to make most parts incompatible, all it needs is a mounting hole shifted sideways as you've obviously found. I remember back in the 70's/80s Vauxhall were doing this trick on Chevettes so people who owned the Opel version (Kadett) couldn't buy a £12 Vauxhall water pump to go on their Opel with what was basically the same engine. Other things like the inlet manifold were altered too which meant the head was different - just a royal pain in the proverbials when everything went pear-shaped! :roll: :wink: :D
Cheers,
Dave

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Re: KV6 Water Pump

Post by thamestyres » Thu Nov 24, 2016 7:04 pm

bmw worked there magic all over the engine and systems, the 800 ran a mems2j management whereas the 75 ran a siemens system.. where the change on the 800 was short lived (only a couple of years) most diagnostics systems didn't bother with the 825, hence a lot of our diagnostic type issues, a lot of systems I have used have been quite poor on 825'S but are ok with most other models.. they do say that most mechanical parts for the two engines are not compatible as well.. heads are deffo comparable I have ran these.. block is different as is the crank I believe.. there are a good mix of what can and can't be used.. but most is trial and error.. regards ricky
Rover Sterling KV6 V.reg 4 tailpipes and rs5 wheels (sold) :shock:
home of the "Mad Maestro"
1935 morris 18/6, having a near end of life rejuvenation, xj6 running gear..

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Re: KV6 Water Pump

Post by scoobyh123 » Thu Nov 24, 2016 8:22 pm

I wasn't far wrong with my tongue in cheek guess then Rick! I still say BMW should never have been allowed to buy Rover but there you go, 20 years too late for anyone to listen! :shock: :(
Cheers,
Dave

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Re: KV6 Water Pump

Post by thamestyres » Thu Nov 24, 2016 10:26 pm

bearing in mind that bmw only wanted mini, how well would rover have done if they had not been sold off and had mini themselves.. might have been the saving of them.. regards ricky
Rover Sterling KV6 V.reg 4 tailpipes and rs5 wheels (sold) :shock:
home of the "Mad Maestro"
1935 morris 18/6, having a near end of life rejuvenation, xj6 running gear..

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Re: KV6 Water Pump

Post by scoobyh123 » Thu Nov 24, 2016 10:51 pm

It does make you wonder doesn't it? Once they had Mini and had plundered Land Rover for the 4x4 technology (hence the X5 appearing soon after) and gained control of the "Sieg Heil!" (Triumph Acclaim) name, Rover was of no further use to them and not wanting it to do well, created loads of rumours such as it was losing £5m a week and so on. They also knew the 600 had outsold the 3 series by 10 to 1 and even the Honda Accord was outselling the 3 series by 3 to 1 and the 800 was the best selling executive car in the UK through the 90s - they had to do a good hatchet job and if that made it near impossible to get parts to continue maintaining the 800s that was probably a bonus.

I can't quite remember when Honda upped the capacity of the C series engine to 3.2L but wouldn't mind betting that talks were already under way between BMW and BAe and that's why we never had an 832 - that and the potential cost of redesigning things to accept the north-south engine with a front drive transaxle. That went further with the advent of the 3.5 Legend as it also gained a rear axle and AWD with front being the primary drive wheels. Bear in mind Honda had a 22% stake in Rover at the time it was sold to BMW, it was feasible the Mk3 800 would have also had a 3.5 V6 and AWD - BMW couldn't have competed against that and i reckon they knew it was on the cards, even at the start of the 90s hence their aggressive takeover.

As far as i'm aware, the "new" Mini was already in near production states of the project at the time of the takeover, hence the early ones (as they are now) being R50 designation, R being for Rover of course. Like you say, if Rover hadn't been sold and had the Mini themselves, it might well have been BMW that went to the wall in 2005 instead of Rover.
What really annoys me is that despite the name, BAe was part owned by the French at the time and i know for a fact that a lot of motoring journalists were given Peugeot and Citroen cars on "long term/indefinite loan", especially those that praised them to the highest and slagged Rover off something rotten.
Cheers,
Dave

'02 Honda CR-V SE Executive
'99 Jag S Type 3.0 V6 SE


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Re: KV6 Water Pump

Post by mjc9967 » Thu Nov 24, 2016 11:55 pm

Maybe the thing to do is re engine my Mk2 with a whole system transplant from a R75 2.5L - that'll future proof it!

Re parts unavailabilty, I blame the Chinese. They bought all sorts of stuff (tooling and licences) for previous models they were never going to use and prevented anyone else being able to produce aftermarket. Are they still making the "Roewe 750"?
Mark

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