Production totals

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Re: Production totals

Post by dollysprint » Mon Mar 16, 2015 1:04 pm

CHR15E wrote:That's fascinating Dave.

I'm actually shocked it's so low overall. Especially seeing the 827 manual figures.

At the risk of moaning. :) Should there be some 827 Sli's there?
Its not moaning and yes there certainly should be some 827 sli figures, however there are none listed as SLi per say. I suspect they are lumped in with the Si figures, I'll try to explain. If we were looking at Mk1's an Si would be defined by the letter S in the chassis number, and an SLi would be defined by the letter Z. This also applies to Mk2 820 models for Si and Sli specs, with certain caveats that complicated this towards the end of Mk2 production that I wont go into now. When it came to Mk2 827's Rover seem to have lost the Z stamp and so Si and SLi just have the S in the chassis number. However if I then physically input the individual registration numbers it then gives me a class specification, Si being class 3.1 and Sli being class 7, so, I am going to have to individually enter the 1744 reg numbers for the 827 Si autos and the 521 Si manuals to be able to separate out the actual SLi's, and that's just for the saloons! The fastbacks are a lesser number but still number nearly 1500 cars, so add that together and I'm looking at just shy of 4000 inputs to be able to further break it down to Si and SLi. It needs to be done but its going to take time, as does seperating off the pre 96 Vitesse Sports Lux from the post 96 Vitesse that were all sports anyway. My love of Rover is undiminished, my hatred for their input clerks has increased considerably :twisted:

Dave
1988 Sterling saloon 2.7 Auto Pulsar over gunmetal
1990 Sterling Saloon 2.7 Auto black over storm
1993 Coupe 2.7 auto white gold 1
2005 Ford Transit 2.4 lwb, Club van
2007 Jaguar X Type 2.2 manual Estate

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Re: Production totals

Post by dollysprint » Mon Mar 16, 2015 1:07 pm

traineefarmer wrote:Brilliant stuff. Can't wait to see the Coupe figures.
You are not going to believe the number for the 2.0 litre Coupes registered in the UK, I don't and the figures are right in front of me :?

Dave
1988 Sterling saloon 2.7 Auto Pulsar over gunmetal
1990 Sterling Saloon 2.7 Auto black over storm
1993 Coupe 2.7 auto white gold 1
2005 Ford Transit 2.4 lwb, Club van
2007 Jaguar X Type 2.2 manual Estate

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Re: Production totals

Post by dollysprint » Mon Mar 16, 2015 3:07 pm

dollysprint wrote:I am now in a position to list production totals for individual models for the Mk2 registered in the UK between September 1991 and September 1998( which will include the cars sat around and registered later on).
I stress this is UK registered cars only and numbers some 75792. There are also a handful of UK registered left hookers, a number of which were registered to the Armed Forces but I shall leave these to one side for now.
Deducting 75792 from the total of 123595 MK2's built also confirms that 47803 were sold overseas, I do not have an individual break down for these cars and the UK figures won't really give any clues either as certain overseas markets have very different automotive tastes to UK buyers, for example Europe favoured Diesel cars long before the UK and the 2.0 litre Coupe sold a lot better in Italy than it did here due to their tax laws.
I have to confess that many of these figures are quite surprising, especially how few 800 Coupes were registered in the UK, especially the 2.0 litre variants, you can make your own minds up. These figures are accurate, they came from a Rover database, I'll start with the saloons, then fastbacks and finally Coupes and list them low spec to high.

SALOONS

820 i manual 6324
820 i auto 1877
827 i manual 95
827 i auto 159
825 i man diesel 844

820 si manual 9004
820 si auto 6442
827 si manual 521
827 si auto 1744
825 si manual kv6 104
825 si auto kv6 156
825 sdi man diesel 1122
820 vitesse 180 550
820 vitesse 180 lux 2080
820 vitesse 200 sport lux 1376 (this includes pre and post 1996 so needs further break down)

820 sli manual 1677
820 sli auto 1761
825 sli manual kv6 260
825 sli auto kv6 685
825 sldi man diesel 298

820 sterling man 243
820 sterling auto 371
827 sterling man 57
827 sterling auto 3702
825 sterling man kv6 46
825 sterling auto kv6 2931

That concludes the saloons, I shall add more tomorrow.
FASTBACK

820 i manual 4593
820 i auto 1187
827 i manual 34
827 i auto 125
825 di manual diesel 634


820 si manual 6168
820 si auto 4445
827 si manual 234
827 si auto 1179
825 si manual kv6 46
825 si auto kv6 109
820 vitesse 180 777
820 vitesse 180 lux 2459
820 vitesse 200 sport lux 1456 (again this includes pre and post 1996 models)
825 sdi manual diesel 882


820 sli man 926
820 sli auto 702
825 sli manual kv6 145
825 sli auto kv6 395
825 sldi manual diesel 197

820 sterling man 100
820 sterling auto 204
827 sterling man 42
827 sterling auto 1322
825 sterling man kv6 45
825 sterling auto kv6 821

That concludes the fastbacks.

Dave
1988 Sterling saloon 2.7 Auto Pulsar over gunmetal
1990 Sterling Saloon 2.7 Auto black over storm
1993 Coupe 2.7 auto white gold 1
2005 Ford Transit 2.4 lwb, Club van
2007 Jaguar X Type 2.2 manual Estate

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Re: Production totals

Post by dollysprint » Mon Mar 16, 2015 3:47 pm

dollysprint wrote:
dollysprint wrote:I am now in a position to list production totals for individual models for the Mk2 registered in the UK between September 1991 and September 1998( which will include the cars sat around and registered later on).
I stress this is UK registered cars only and numbers some 75792. There are also a handful of UK registered left hookers, a number of which were registered to the Armed Forces but I shall leave these to one side for now.
Deducting 75792 from the total of 123595 MK2's built also confirms that 47803 were sold overseas, I do not have an individual break down for these cars and the UK figures won't really give any clues either as certain overseas markets have very different automotive tastes to UK buyers, for example Europe favoured Diesel cars long before the UK and the 2.0 litre Coupe sold a lot better in Italy than it did here due to their tax laws.
I have to confess that many of these figures are quite surprising, especially how few 800 Coupes were registered in the UK, especially the 2.0 litre variants, you can make your own minds up. These figures are accurate, they came from a Rover database, I'll start with the saloons, then fastbacks and finally Coupes and list them low spec to high.

SALOONS

820 i manual 6324
820 i auto 1877
827 i manual 95
827 i auto 159
825 i man diesel 844

820 si manual 9004
820 si auto 6442
827 si manual 521
827 si auto 1744
825 si manual kv6 104
825 si auto kv6 156
825 sdi man diesel 1122
820 vitesse 180 550
820 vitesse 180 lux 2080
820 vitesse 200 sport lux 1376 (this includes pre and post 1996 so needs further break down)

820 sli manual 1677
820 sli auto 1761
825 sli manual kv6 260
825 sli auto kv6 685
825 sldi man diesel 298

820 sterling man 243
820 sterling auto 371
827 sterling man 57
827 sterling auto 3702
825 sterling man kv6 46
825 sterling auto kv6 2931

That concludes the saloons, I shall add more tomorrow.
FASTBACK

820 i manual 4593
820 i auto 1187
827 i manual 34
827 i auto 125
825 di manual diesel 634


820 si manual 6168
820 si auto 4445
827 si manual 234
827 si auto 1179
825 si manual kv6 46
825 si auto kv6 109
820 vitesse 180 777
820 vitesse 180 lux 2459
820 vitesse 200 sport lux 1456 (again this includes pre and post 1996 models)
825 sdi manual diesel 882


820 sli man 926
820 sli auto 702
825 sli manual kv6 145
825 sli auto kv6 395
825 sldi manual diesel 197

820 sterling man 100
820 sterling auto 204
827 sterling man 42
827 sterling auto 1322
825 sterling man kv6 45
825 sterling auto kv6 821

That concludes the fastbacks.

Dave

And finally Coupe. For those who don't know both the 2.0 litre and KV6 engined Coupes were only available in the UK from January 1996 and slightly later for the 2.0 litre. 2.0 litre Coupes had been available in Europe since 1993 with Italy taking over 600 2.0 litre Coupes alone in that year. 827 Coupes were available from mid 1992 until december 1995.

820 sterling manual 104
820 sterling auto 106
827 manual 73
827 auto 631
825 sterling manual 49
825 sterling auto 659
820 vitesse 514 ( so when someone advertised one on ebay last month stating 1 of only 500 built, in UK terms at least he was remarkably accurate!)



So all this gives body style build totals of;-

saloons 44429
fastbacks 29227
coupes 2136


Dave
1988 Sterling saloon 2.7 Auto Pulsar over gunmetal
1990 Sterling Saloon 2.7 Auto black over storm
1993 Coupe 2.7 auto white gold 1
2005 Ford Transit 2.4 lwb, Club van
2007 Jaguar X Type 2.2 manual Estate

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Re: Production totals

Post by TDHFastback » Mon Mar 16, 2015 4:20 pm

Thats fascinating reading Dave.
The saloon was definitely king.
Which could be the result of Rovers marketing policies at the time, of targeting older, more mature, drivers (who tend to be 800 customers anyway) with the saloon whilst younger more dynamic upstarts where ushered towards the fastback.

Thanks for all your research. I assume (and hope) it is all saved elsewhere in case this thing goes.... ecky ecky ecky ecky Fzzzzzzzzing fapow fizzzzzz.....

Kate :D
D reg Rover 820Si Saloon. No space for a a saloon in this rootin tootin town
G reg Rover 820SE Fastback (my every day runabout) that ran off.
G reg Rover 827Si police Fastback (last Mk1 jam sandwich)
V reg Rover 825 Sterling Fastback (end of an era)

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Re: Production totals

Post by dollysprint » Mon Mar 16, 2015 4:42 pm

Thanks Kate, tis indeed saved elsewhere.
If any of our European members are friendly with their local X part spares stockist, let me know, I have a favour to ask!

Dave
1988 Sterling saloon 2.7 Auto Pulsar over gunmetal
1990 Sterling Saloon 2.7 Auto black over storm
1993 Coupe 2.7 auto white gold 1
2005 Ford Transit 2.4 lwb, Club van
2007 Jaguar X Type 2.2 manual Estate

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Re: Production totals

Post by CHR15E » Mon Mar 16, 2015 5:26 pm

dollysprint wrote:
CHR15E wrote:That's fascinating Dave.

I'm actually shocked it's so low overall. Especially seeing the 827 manual figures.

At the risk of moaning. :) Should there be some 827 Sli's there?
Its not moaning and yes there certainly should be some 827 sli figures, however there are none listed as SLi per say. I suspect they are lumped in with the Si figures, I'll try to explain. If we were looking at Mk1's an Si would be defined by the letter S in the chassis number, and an SLi would be defined by the letter Z. This also applies to Mk2 820 models for Si and Sli specs, with certain caveats that complicated this towards the end of Mk2 production that I wont go into now. When it came to Mk2 827's Rover seem to have lost the Z stamp and so Si and SLi just have the S in the chassis number. However if I then physically input the individual registration numbers it then gives me a class specification, Si being class 3.1 and Sli being class 7, so, I am going to have to individually enter the 1744 reg numbers for the 827 Si autos and the 521 Si manuals to be able to separate out the actual SLi's, and that's just for the saloons! The fastbacks are a lesser number but still number nearly 1500 cars, so add that together and I'm looking at just shy of 4000 inputs to be able to further break it down to Si and SLi. It needs to be done but its going to take time, as does seperating off the pre 96 Vitesse Sports Lux from the post 96 Vitesse that were all sports anyway. My love of Rover is undiminished, my hatred for their input clerks has increased considerably :twisted:

Dave
Understood mate. :D

I am genuinely amazed some of the figures are so low. Some of the specific models were rare from new let alone now.
Chris
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08 Vauxhall Astra 2.0T Design Twintop
02 Jeep Grand Cherokee Overland 4.7 V8 HO

Previously owned 57 800s 2000-2012
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Re: Production totals

Post by rovercoup » Mon Mar 16, 2015 6:03 pm

/quote]
Understood mate. :D

I am genuinely amazed some of the figures are so low. Some of the specific models were rare from new let alone now.[/quote]

That is what struck me as well Chris, I bet there are a few people now on the hunt for an 827 i fastback manual, only 34 made WOW.

I can't believe how low the number is for Vitesse fastback lux and sport :shock:

Dave, where does my 1994 2.0 turbo coupe fit in all of this? is it sport is vitesse? we know it shouldn't exist but it does :D
Rover 827 Vitesse Fastback Man Mk1 89
Rover 827 Sterling saloon Auto 90
Rover 820 Fastback 2.0 MPi Auto 90
Rover 820 Coupe sport 94
Rover 827 Sterling Saloon 95 auto
Rover 820 Vitesse Fastback 98
Rover 25 2.0TD 01
MGTF 135 02
Rover 45 1.6 SE 05

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Re: Production totals

Post by SJG » Mon Mar 16, 2015 6:26 pm

Thanks again Dave, this is fascinating
Simon

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Re: Production totals

Post by dollysprint » Mon Mar 16, 2015 8:13 pm

rovercoup wrote:/quote]
Understood mate. :D

I am genuinely amazed some of the figures are so low. Some of the specific models were rare from new let alone now.
That is what struck me as well Chris, I bet there are a few people now on the hunt for an 827 i fastback manual, only 34 made WOW.

I can't believe how low the number is for Vitesse fastback lux and sport :shock:

Dave, where does my 1994 2.0 turbo coupe fit in all of this? is it sport is vitesse? we know it shouldn't exist but it does :D[/quote]

Your Coupe doesn't appear Steve, beginning to wonder if yours was ever actually suppose to escape from the factory. However 2 other strange Coupes do appear. One is a left hand drive, UK registered L506FOH on the 5th july 1994 fitted with the 180bhp engine with a gearbox I have yet to determine. And the other is left hand drive, UK registered M942XFL on the 13th March 1995 fitted with the 200bhp engine and again an unknown gearbox but showing a weight of 1770kgs, about 300kgs heavier than a standard 800!They were last taxed in 1998 and 2000 respectively and neither were exported. You'll notice however they were around the same time as yours was zipping around Cowley, or Canley.

Dave
1988 Sterling saloon 2.7 Auto Pulsar over gunmetal
1990 Sterling Saloon 2.7 Auto black over storm
1993 Coupe 2.7 auto white gold 1
2005 Ford Transit 2.4 lwb, Club van
2007 Jaguar X Type 2.2 manual Estate

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Re: Production totals

Post by rovercoup » Mon Mar 16, 2015 8:21 pm

that is spooky!! what still bothers me is that paint pen mark of kv6 on the bell housing in 1994, I guess we will never know but then when you have just uncovered such data anything is possible. It is monday after all.

Oh and by the way you owe me one for pointing out the door mouldings on the mk1 (OCD) B%£$ard :lol:
Rover 827 Vitesse Fastback Man Mk1 89
Rover 827 Sterling saloon Auto 90
Rover 820 Fastback 2.0 MPi Auto 90
Rover 820 Coupe sport 94
Rover 827 Sterling Saloon 95 auto
Rover 820 Vitesse Fastback 98
Rover 25 2.0TD 01
MGTF 135 02
Rover 45 1.6 SE 05

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Re: Production totals

Post by scoobyh123 » Mon Mar 16, 2015 8:48 pm

Err - yeah! What Chris and Kate just said and then some!! Certainly some awesome work and an amazing amount of effort gone into it so for my part of enjoyment of those figures, thank you very much! I'm sure the same view will be echoed by anyone needing, wanting or just curious enough to look!

Many moons ago when i had my first Mk1 Sterling and then about 8 years later when i wanted my second Sterling (had to be an 827 for me) both cars came along almost literally within days of starting to search so like many others that haven't appreciated the cars for their true worth, i thought they were relatively commonplace. That said i obviously did appreciate them else i wouldn't have wanted them.
However these figures go to show that (like Chris said), many models were rare even when new. Taking my Sterling as an example, only 3702 from new (827 Sterling auto saloon) but only 57 of the manual versions?!?!?!?! Last time i checked on how many leftcom or whatever it's called, they were no longer listing the 93MY 827 Sterling auto saloon as a separate model as there were only 3 left, one of which i know to be mine. The previous time i checked it showed 3 which is how i know it only showed 3 from 1993MY as still around.

I know this is going to be a lot of work for you and it's only a suggestion, is there any way you could do a comparison of quantity new to quantity surviving now?

The bit about the Si/SLi being lumped together is interesting. Am i right in thinking a Class 4 interior denotes leather? Would that make an 827 SLi with factory leather a rare one even when new?
Cheers,
Dave

'02 Honda CR-V SE Executive
'99 Jag S Type 3.0 V6 SE


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'94 827 Sterling saloon
'88 Volvo 760 V6 Estate
'95 827 Coupé LPG gone but not forgotten!

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Re: Production totals

Post by dollysprint » Mon Mar 16, 2015 9:26 pm

rovercoup wrote:that is spooky!! what still bothers me is that paint pen mark of kv6 on the bell housing in 1994, I guess we will never know but then when you have just uncovered such data anything is possible. It is monday after all.

Oh and by the way you owe me one for pointing out the door mouldings on the mk1 (OCD) B%£$ard :lol:
He he satin black rattle can and its sorted, oh and a garage..................oh and british summertime!

Dave
1988 Sterling saloon 2.7 Auto Pulsar over gunmetal
1990 Sterling Saloon 2.7 Auto black over storm
1993 Coupe 2.7 auto white gold 1
2005 Ford Transit 2.4 lwb, Club van
2007 Jaguar X Type 2.2 manual Estate

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Re: Production totals

Post by rovercoup » Mon Mar 16, 2015 9:43 pm

two out out of three >>>>>>> :D
Rover 827 Vitesse Fastback Man Mk1 89
Rover 827 Sterling saloon Auto 90
Rover 820 Fastback 2.0 MPi Auto 90
Rover 820 Coupe sport 94
Rover 827 Sterling Saloon 95 auto
Rover 820 Vitesse Fastback 98
Rover 25 2.0TD 01
MGTF 135 02
Rover 45 1.6 SE 05

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Re: Production totals

Post by dollysprint » Mon Mar 16, 2015 9:53 pm

scoobyh123 wrote:Err - yeah! What Chris and Kate just said and then some!! Certainly some awesome work and an amazing amount of effort gone into it so for my part of enjoyment of those figures, thank you very much! I'm sure the same view will be echoed by anyone needing, wanting or just curious enough to look!

Many moons ago when i had my first Mk1 Sterling and then about 8 years later when i wanted my second Sterling (had to be an 827 for me) both cars came along almost literally within days of starting to search so like many others that haven't appreciated the cars for their true worth, i thought they were relatively commonplace. That said i obviously did appreciate them else i wouldn't have wanted them.
However these figures go to show that (like Chris said), many models were rare even when new. Taking my Sterling as an example, only 3702 from new (827 Sterling auto saloon) but only 57 of the manual versions?!?!?!?! Last time i checked on how many leftcom or whatever it's called, they were no longer listing the 93MY 827 Sterling auto saloon as a separate model as there were only 3 left, one of which i know to be mine. The previous time i checked it showed 3 which is how i know it only showed 3 from 1993MY as still around.

I know this is going to be a lot of work for you and it's only a suggestion, is there any way you could do a comparison of quantity new to quantity surviving now?

The bit about the Si/SLi being lumped together is interesting. Am i right in thinking a Class 4 interior denotes leather? Would that make an 827 SLi with factory leather a rare one even when new?
We could all look up How many left.com to give a ball park figure I suppose, although its accuracy is questionable as it only lists sorn and tax which does leave some cars slipping through the net.
The class system for Rover 800's and there corresponding chassis letters are as follows;-

C = STERLING or class 8
Z = SLI or class 7
W= VITESSE high spec or lux or class 5
S = SI or vitesse standard or class 3.1
H= i or class 2

Options wouldn't alter the chassis code, but a leather clad non sterling would be rare as would a cloth clad sterling, which was also an option.

On a separate note the low number of V6 manuals I don't find so surprising, this was afterall an executive class car, its the low take up of the the 2.0 litre Coupe that surprised me, then again perhaps its low for the same reason as V6 manuals. Also at first glance the KV6 coupe out selling the C27 coupe in less time seems at odds until you look at the retail price for each car and realise that an 827 coupe in december 1995 listed at +£30000. A month later in January 1996 you could buy a KV6 Coupe listed at £25000. Was this a reflection of what Rover were paying Honda for the C27? or a realisation by Rover that £30000 was too much for a 2 door 800?

Dave
1988 Sterling saloon 2.7 Auto Pulsar over gunmetal
1990 Sterling Saloon 2.7 Auto black over storm
1993 Coupe 2.7 auto white gold 1
2005 Ford Transit 2.4 lwb, Club van
2007 Jaguar X Type 2.2 manual Estate

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