Scoobys Dogmobile - Take 2!

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Re: Scoobys Dogmobile - Take 2!

Post by scoobyh123 » Fri Feb 24, 2017 10:46 pm

Been a while since i posted anything because the old beast just keeps plodding on. I did buy and fit a new washer pump and it has improved the output of the washer jets.

On a slightly different subject which i've mentioned a couple of times, tracking! I tried the string line and tape measure method and found the N/S wheel was toeing out considerably - like at least 13mm! I returned that to where i thought it should be, rechecked and lost all tension in the string (actually strimmer line) and just couldn't get it right again.
Knowing it was still out, although it drives much better with less tendency to go where it thinks it will, i bought a Trackace Laser Tracking kit.

Tried it out today :

Image

Bit tricky to read from that angle of dangle but it's showing 1 deg 40 min or 1.666 degrees of toe out. That equates to about 15mm - bear in mind i had already wound the nearside TRE in by about 13mm so total was about 30mm out as it has to go to 2mm toe in or 18 minutes.

That means after originally having the tracking supposedly set correctly, it was a shocking 30mm or thereabouts out - no wonder it was clearly visible by eye! :shock: The steering was heavy too, even with the power assistance and is already much lighter!
The handling is also more sure-footed, on xmas eve i went to take a roundabout quickly and found myself heading towards a non-existent exit in the direction i was traveling before i turned the steering wheel - brown trouser moment!

The cynical thought crossed my mind that maybe the tyre place deliberately mistracked it so it would scrub the tyres out so i'd visit them for new ones and another tracking session. If so, they've lost out! Wouldn't trust them with a unicycle now, they'd probably misalign that as well! :roll: :lol:

I'll do a bit of a review on the Trackace when i've got some more photos and sorted the tracking with it. So far it's been easy enough to use but could do with a "sight-card" or something to help when trying to aim the laser and/or mirror. The laser dot is so small and the mirrors reflection of it is small too with not a very big target area (scale) so it's like trying to shoot a flea of a camels back at 1000 paces with a spud-gun!

More on that when i do the next update/review and i already have plans to adapt the Trackace so it can be used on the 800 range to adjust the rear tracking referenced directly to the front axle - just needs one additional component - either a mirror at exactly 45 degrees mounted on the laser source or a vertical/horizontal laser line thingummywhatsitflipdoodah - i've gone for the second choice :

Image

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/182403301080? ... EBIDX%3AIT

If it goes according to plan it should work very well - i hope! :wink: :D
Cheers,
Dave

'02 Honda CR-V SE Executive
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Re: Scoobys Dogmobile - Take 2!

Post by zcar12 » Sun Feb 26, 2017 12:23 pm

Great post Dave, please keep us informed on development with the Laser Tracking device.

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Re: Scoobys Dogmobile - Take 2!

Post by CHR15E » Sun Feb 26, 2017 12:52 pm

Are local garages really that useless at doing tracking?
Chris
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Re: Scoobys Dogmobile - Take 2!

Post by scoobyh123 » Sun Feb 26, 2017 1:08 pm

zcar12 wrote:Great post Dave, please keep us informed on development with the Laser Tracking device.
Will do Nick! :D
CHR15E wrote:Are local garages really that useless at doing tracking?
Best of it all Chris, they're part of a national chain - not giving the name away but the initials are ATS and the second time they "adjusted" it, it was slightly better but still skittish on the front and likely to pull any which way it felt like.

They charged me each time (£35.99) which is the amount the Trackace cost me (£72) and have previously charged me 2x £35.99 to track my Coupé (front and back) and also damaged the RS 7-spokes fitted on the back of my Coupé at the time by using a windy-gun to do the nuts up and then checking with a torque wrench! :roll:

I would have complained about the wheels but i only found out a few months after and during my second Volvo-tracking visit i happened to see a memo from Head Office about another complaint of wheels being damaged by use of a windy-gun! :shock:
Cheers,
Dave

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Re: Scoobys Dogmobile - Take 2!

Post by scoobyh123 » Sun Feb 26, 2017 2:55 pm

Todays mission was to remove and inspect the distributor cap and rotor arm as just lately it's been a bit tricky to start, particularly when cold and the idle has been a bit "hit and miss" with a flat spot when accelerating.

I was expecting a bit of dirt and probably some verdigris on the contacts inside the cap and a dirty rotor arm. This was the first view i had of the inside of the cap :

Image

Image

And the rotor arm, not a great pic because it's so close :

Image

Removing the black splashproof cover revealed this :

Image

Oops! :roll: :oops:

Image

This was about as good as i could get it using a wire brush in my Dremel-type tool but look at that date code!!! That means it is the original so has been on for all of its 217k+ miles and 30 ish years! As you can see i managed to get the carbon brush back in ok and it fired up a lot easier :

Image

Image

For now it will do, i'll have to track down and order a new cap and arm. They're shared with 6 cylinder BMWs and so are somewhat pricey :x last time i checked it was near £80 for the pair! Anyway, it starts easier, idles smoothly even when cold and hopefully the flat spot will be gone! :wink: :D
Cheers,
Dave

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Re: Scoobys Dogmobile - Take 2!

Post by traineefarmer » Sun Feb 26, 2017 9:27 pm

Is the dizzy a bosch item dave? If so try APD. They have a branch in Norwich and are my "last chance saloon" for hard to find or expensive parts. They were the only place that could source a genuine Valeo clutch kit for my Coupe and when I briefly ran a Porsche 944, they supplied a genuine bosch cap and arm for a 5th of what anyone else could quote.

As for ATS and tracking, they are utterly hopeless! I know the guys at my local branch quite well (even though I no longer use them) and apparently the issue is constant budget cuts to the branches mean they cannot maintain and calibrate the equipment properly. They are even no longer allowed to hold common parts in stock - not even exhaust clamps and mounts! This does not bode well for things like torque wrenches and balancing machines, which like tracking gauges need regular calibration.

I took my car to Kwik-Fit tyre pros in Dereham a few months ago after a recommendation. A very professional outfit for a fast-fit centre with very up to date equipment. They spent a good hour doing a 4 wheel track on the Rover and it drove very well after.

Not cheap. A tracking check is "free" but they charge for adjustments. Roughly £50 for the front, then £25 for each rear corner. Interestingly, they offer a 2 year "tracking guarantee" for an extra £25 where they will recheck and adjust the tracking for free for two years after it has been set. I told the manager that I was planning some suspension work on the rear, would the guarantee still apply?

"Yes".

I think they're going to be sick of the sight of me by the end of 2018!
Tom.

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Re: Scoobys Dogmobile - Take 2!

Post by scoobyh123 » Sun Feb 26, 2017 10:25 pm

Thanks Tom - i'll give them a call tomorrow. I searched their online shop for "Distributor Cap" and got :


APD Website

Sorry there are no items in this category.

:roll:

At the moment the favourite for genuine Bosch is :

https://www.bestpartstore.co.uk/volvo/7 ... d%5B%5D=30

but they also do Bremi :

https://www.bestpartstore.co.uk/volvo/7 ... d%5B%5D=47

They're expensive because they're shared with BMW 6-pots as well as the obvious PRV models - oh yeah, and the DeL'Orean DMC12 aka Dr Emmett Browns Time Machine. :wink: :lol:
I seem to recall when i needed a cap and arm for my last 740 (2.3 4-pot) the cap was £35 (not Bosch) and that was expensive because it was shared with Porsche 924/944 models!

Yours is the first positive comment i've heard about Fik-Wit, i hope they checked the rear end first on your car? At least they knew the back end could be adjusted, ATS tried telling me there was no adjustment on the rear of an 800 of any description!

"I think they're going to be sick of the sight of me by the end of 2018!" End of 2017, get it right! :wink: :lol: :D
Cheers,
Dave

'02 Honda CR-V SE Executive
'99 Jag S Type 3.0 V6 SE


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Re: Scoobys Dogmobile - Take 2!

Post by traineefarmer » Mon Feb 27, 2017 10:14 am

APD's website is pretty useless, like many of the motor factors. I find you can nearly always get a better price and better range of parts by calling.

As for ATS, I've been told the same by them about rear tracking. I think you'll find the truth is their equipment can only track a single axle at a time so they simply don't bother.
scoobyh123 wrote:"I think they're going to be sick of the sight of me by the end of 2018!" End of 2017, get it right! :wink: :lol: :D
:lol: I have this effect on people!
Tom.

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Re: Scoobys Dogmobile - Take 2!

Post by scoobyh123 » Mon Feb 27, 2017 11:20 am

I'll give them a call later Tom, see what they can come up with. Know what you mean about motor factors websites, if it doesn't fit 99% of the car parc then they don't bother listing it as it's too much grief as people will order the cheapest for their Corsa/Sax/Golf assuming it will fit regardless then moan like hell because theirs is the most expensive one and the website should have told them! :roll:

I suspect you're right about ATS tracking gear or more to the point, they simply can't be bothered as it's outside their "normal" remit of front wheel alignment.

I know what you're like for getting things right so when you do your suspension mods you'll probably be in KF in Dereham after every alteration, "just to make sure" - make sur you get every pennys worth out of that guarantee! :wink: :lol: :D
Cheers,
Dave

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Re: Scoobys Dogmobile - Take 2!

Post by scoobyh123 » Thu Mar 02, 2017 3:53 pm

After getting the tracking finally sorted (pics to follow later) i took the wee beastie for a test run and to get some petrol as it was running on vapours.
On the journey there it started to make some nasty noises from the front end, particularly the drivers side. :shock:
On the way back this grew to a serious bad knocking sound. :shock: :shock:
Got home and shook the O/S/F wheel, BANG - BANG - BANG!!!

Initially suspecting the lower ball joint, proper investigation today revealed it to be the wheel bearing. There are three main sorts of wheel bearings fitted to the 700 series Volvo, depending on year of manufacture and then model.The cheap ones are the conical adjustable jobbies. Not quite so cheap and with little or no adjustment, the conical bearings aka taper roller bearings. Both are replaceable without renewing the hub.
Then there is the last sort, straight roller bearings (similar to the 800) built-in to the hub assembly. These are the expensive ones and also NLA from Volvo but my friendly local Volvo dealer did give me the part number.

Quick search on fleabay and it came up with 2 NOS jobbies for £2.99 each + £9.95 P&P each. A bit of doble-checking/cross-referencing to make sure and i bought both. The line of thought is if the drivers side bearing can fail so suddenly and quickly, the passenger side isn't that far behind! As such i'll do the passenger side as well, just to be on the safe side. :wink: :D
Cheers,
Dave

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Re: Scoobys Dogmobile - Take 2!

Post by scoobyh123 » Thu Mar 02, 2017 11:24 pm

Couple of quick pics of the tracking :

Image

Image

Image

Image

Pic 1 - setting up the laser and the reflected beam to zero degrees referenced off the N/S wheel
Pic 2 - shows the 0 deg reference
Pic 3 - transfer the mirror/bar assembly to the O/S wheel to measure the total toe angle
Pic 4 - aiming for 18' +/- 8' and this is 20' as near as so well within spec.

Apart from the actual adjustment and the need to recalibrate after each adjustment, it's pretty much as simple as that! :P

Now for this poxy wheel bearing!!! :x :evil: :x

After removing the brake disc and the hubnut, the hub assembly complete with (the remains of) the bearings just slid off, revealing the stub axle :

Image

Note the gritty looking grease deposits on the flange, obviously been waiting a while to go!

Hub assembly removed :

Image

The outer bearing showing signs of grease escaping - whether that came from the inner bearing and worked its way through i don't know.

Image

The inner bearing shield lifting complete with the inner centre race :

Image

Even easier to see from this angle of dangle!

Image

Rumour has it the new bearings are landing on monday, meanwhile if any (more) wet stuff drops out of the sky this should keep it dry :

Image

Hopefully it will be a case of cleaning the flange then just a "spanner job" to get it all working again as it should! :wink: :D
Cheers,
Dave

'02 Honda CR-V SE Executive
'99 Jag S Type 3.0 V6 SE


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'94 827 Sterling saloon
'88 Volvo 760 V6 Estate
'95 827 Coupé LPG gone but not forgotten!

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Re: Scoobys Dogmobile - Take 2!

Post by CHR15E » Fri Mar 03, 2017 6:37 am

That could have been very nasty!

My mate Joe had a similar thing happen on a Jag a few years back. From memory because of the way it failed the brakes were the only thing keeping the wheel on. He had hours of fun trying to get that sorted. Looks like yours will be a lot more straight forward.
Chris
19 Vauxhall Astra 1.6T SRi Nav Estate
08 Vauxhall Astra 2.0T Design Twintop
02 Jeep Grand Cherokee Overland 4.7 V8 HO

Previously owned 57 800s 2000-2012
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Re: Scoobys Dogmobile - Take 2!

Post by scoobyh123 » Fri Mar 03, 2017 8:09 am

You''re not wrong at all there Chris! It was a combination of the outer bearing and the brake disc holding it in there. :shock:
As you can see from the pics, it hadn't been gone long when i removed it, i might even have noticed it sooner if it wasn't for the roads round here being so rough and it has crossed my mind that could have contributed to the failure of the bearing. :wink: :D
Cheers,
Dave

'02 Honda CR-V SE Executive
'99 Jag S Type 3.0 V6 SE


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Re: Scoobys Dogmobile - Take 2!

Post by traineefarmer » Fri Mar 03, 2017 8:28 am

Dave - Have you ever tried these guys for wheel bearings?

http://www.brt-bearings.com/

Their head office is in Wisbech and they have an automotive division which packages bearings for national motor factors. The best thing is they always use branded bearings, unlike the brown box things you can some times end up with from ebay.

Mind you, they can't do 800 bearing kits! :roll:
Tom.

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Re: Scoobys Dogmobile - Take 2!

Post by scoobyh123 » Fri Mar 03, 2017 9:49 am

Not heard of those people Tom but thanks anyway. I've already ordered the ones i found on fleabay, at the price they were listed at it was rude not to! :wink: :lol: :P

Also the bearings are exactly what has come off :

Image

even down to the manufacturer (SKF) and country of manufacture (Italy) so they should match exactly what was on there, except for the wear of course!

Having dealt with that seller many times over the years i know the photo is of the exact item so no worries about the brown box stuff that as you rightly say could be anything from a cheap Asian copy made from cheese to a proper SKF, Toyo,Timken or similar quality bearing.
More likely to be the cheese one though. :roll:

What i might do is try and source the bearings at a later point and fit them in the original hubs so i have a spare set ready to fit in another 217000 miles. I'm just glad i was only going to Brandon and back for petrol when it went and not on the M11 doing 110 in the outside lane! :shock: That would be in kmh obviously Officer! :wink: :lol:

The one thing that does jar me off a little is i'd finally got the tracking right (first time in my ownership of the car) and before the bearing went it drove really well - how it should in fact. I'll obviously have to re-check it after and hopefully it will still be spot on, i'll be extremely miffed (and embarrassed! :oops: ) if i find it's suddenly toeing in by about 30mm! :wink: :D
Cheers,
Dave

'02 Honda CR-V SE Executive
'99 Jag S Type 3.0 V6 SE


Image
'94 827 Sterling saloon
'88 Volvo 760 V6 Estate
'95 827 Coupé LPG gone but not forgotten!

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