Manalishis 820 Vitesse Coupe

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Manalishi
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Re: Manalishis 820 Vitesse Coupe

Post by Manalishi » Sun Aug 26, 2018 3:20 pm

No worries, I'll just have to order something else 16mm wide. Sad really as the profile was perfect after cutting it. I really don't like colour coding the details, I want the chrome and the wood interior details.
Henrik
Rover 820 Vitesse Coupe 180bhp -93 (Italy)
Rover 827 Vitesse manual (non cat) -89 (Spain)
Lexus GS450h -13
Austin Seven Special -36
Gone:
Rover 820 ti -95
Rover 216 DOHC coupe -93
Rover 620 ti -98

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Re: Manalishis 820 Vitesse Coupe

Post by scoobyh123 » Sun Aug 26, 2018 4:25 pm

Sad really that it didn't work. If it's now 16mm wide from top to bottom, how thick is it from the bottom inside corner to the outside bottom corner?

If it's 16mm top to bottom and 4mm thick at the bottom, you'll need something about 17mm wide if you go for the wedge profile idea behind it. If you could find something wedge shaped as a backing piece say 16 x 4mm but wedge shaped, the "long side" would be about 17mm (16.89mm) and this probably sounds picky but the last thing you'd want is a millimetre of the backing showing if you did that.

It would almost certainly give you the right profile that way but would be twice as much work fitting it, especially on the corner bits.

The other alternative would be to contact Sumex and send them an offcut of the modified but you've done, explaining what you want and ask if there's any way they could make it. :wink: :D
Cheers,
Dave

'02 Honda CR-V SE Executive
'99 Jag S Type 3.0 V6 SE


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Manalishi
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Re: Manalishis 820 Vitesse Coupe

Post by Manalishi » Mon Aug 27, 2018 6:16 pm

Oh dear. Misfortunes comes hand in hand. Today my charging light went on. 12v on the battery when running. Gah!! Fortunately I have a spare alternator from Gunnars coupe so hoping to have the strenght and willpower to swap them tomorrow or thursday.
Henrik
Rover 820 Vitesse Coupe 180bhp -93 (Italy)
Rover 827 Vitesse manual (non cat) -89 (Spain)
Lexus GS450h -13
Austin Seven Special -36
Gone:
Rover 820 ti -95
Rover 216 DOHC coupe -93
Rover 620 ti -98

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Re: Manalishis 820 Vitesse Coupe

Post by scoobyh123 » Mon Aug 27, 2018 6:35 pm

If you've got the older A127 (not the newer A127i) alternator Henrik there's a very high chance it's the voltage regulator/brushbox and the brushes are worn out. Only three screws to remove it, either 5.5mm or 1/4" hex heads to remove it then you "tip" it out in a sort of arc movement. If the brushes are worn, have a look inside (one of those "dentists mirrors" is often handy for this) at the slip rings, if they're good you'll probably get away with just changing the brush box/voltage regulator.

These are the voltage regs :

https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/LUCAS-A127-T ... 2976014626

Image

Also worth checking the field wire connection on the back of the alternator, i've known them to break and the broken end earth the charge warning lamp out. Quite correctly it means no charge as the field connection has gone resulting in no charge out of the alternator. :wink: :D
Cheers,
Dave

'02 Honda CR-V SE Executive
'99 Jag S Type 3.0 V6 SE


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'94 827 Sterling saloon
'88 Volvo 760 V6 Estate
'95 827 Coupé LPG gone but not forgotten!

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Manalishi
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Re: Manalishis 820 Vitesse Coupe

Post by Manalishi » Mon Aug 27, 2018 6:51 pm

Excellent info, thanks Dave! I will check the obvious stuff first.

Do you know when the newer alternator was introduced? The spare one is from a later car, but still with dizzy etc allthough a 200bhp one, mine is originally 180.
Henrik
Rover 820 Vitesse Coupe 180bhp -93 (Italy)
Rover 827 Vitesse manual (non cat) -89 (Spain)
Lexus GS450h -13
Austin Seven Special -36
Gone:
Rover 820 ti -95
Rover 216 DOHC coupe -93
Rover 620 ti -98

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Re: Manalishis 820 Vitesse Coupe

Post by scoobyh123 » Mon Aug 27, 2018 7:04 pm

As far as i know, the later one came along with the 1996-on changes - however there's no guarantee that a post-96 car will have the later type, especially if it still has a dizzy on a 200bhp car - you know what Rover were like for using up the older stock before starting on the new stuff!

You might be lucky and find the spare alternator has the right type, if not and it's not something obvious like a broken wire then if you're lucky the voltage regulator will be a cheap fix, if you're unlucky, reconditioned A127s are relatively cheap anyway. They are also sold as Magnetti-Marelli, Marelli and Lucas-Marelli names, should be a 5 digit part number on it somewhere to identify exactly which one you have as well.

A quick check once you're repaired it is charging voltage on a cold regulator (engine just started) should be 14.0 - 14.4v and should drop to 14v as it warms up. :wink: :D
Cheers,
Dave

'02 Honda CR-V SE Executive
'99 Jag S Type 3.0 V6 SE


Image
'94 827 Sterling saloon
'88 Volvo 760 V6 Estate
'95 827 Coupé LPG gone but not forgotten!

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Manalishi
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Re: Manalishis 820 Vitesse Coupe

Post by Manalishi » Wed Aug 29, 2018 3:47 pm

So managed to swap the alternators just now. I was a bit puzzled as they are both labeled A127I but they are identical so no problem I guess.

The charge is a tad low at 13.75 but at least it’s doing something as the previous was lower.

The plan now is to refurbish the old and swap back to have a good second unit at hand.

The chrome trim hasn’t deteriorated any further so hopefully the plastic coating is sticking to the chrome protecting it. Time Will tell!


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Image
Henrik
Rover 820 Vitesse Coupe 180bhp -93 (Italy)
Rover 827 Vitesse manual (non cat) -89 (Spain)
Lexus GS450h -13
Austin Seven Special -36
Gone:
Rover 820 ti -95
Rover 216 DOHC coupe -93
Rover 620 ti -98

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scoobyh123
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Re: Manalishis 820 Vitesse Coupe

Post by scoobyh123 » Wed Aug 29, 2018 8:22 pm

That's definitely an A127i Henrik - it's the oldest i've seen of that variety!

Glad you've got it sorted, did you charge the battery at all or was it still a bit low when you fitted the alternator? If so that could explain the low charging voltage. Did the charging light go out as it should on start up?

By the way, the voltage regulator i previously linked to almost certainly won't be right for the A127i - i'd need to do a bit of checking as i can't remember the voltage reg for it.
Cheers,
Dave

'02 Honda CR-V SE Executive
'99 Jag S Type 3.0 V6 SE


Image
'94 827 Sterling saloon
'88 Volvo 760 V6 Estate
'95 827 Coupé LPG gone but not forgotten!

User avatar
Manalishi
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Re: Manalishis 820 Vitesse Coupe

Post by Manalishi » Wed Aug 29, 2018 8:54 pm

Yes Dave, lights gone, but when I measured the current before I ripped the old alternator out it was a bit low too, so might very well have been somewhat low from not charging for an hour or so. I'm starting tomorrow morning with a drive so I'll measure it again after that. I think it's going to be ok.

I realized the regulator you linked was probably wrong but I'm in no hurry. By the way, is it possible to find any faults on the old alternator while it's on the bench? I'm useless with this stuff to begin with but I have a very good car electric guy in my community that fixed my alternator for my old 620ti, but that was a more modern beast with a busted diode bridge. The extra plus is he cleans it up in an ultra sonic sound bath and everything is tip top when you get it back. Not too expensive either, so might be worth it, and keeping the other one as a spare.
Henrik
Rover 820 Vitesse Coupe 180bhp -93 (Italy)
Rover 827 Vitesse manual (non cat) -89 (Spain)
Lexus GS450h -13
Austin Seven Special -36
Gone:
Rover 820 ti -95
Rover 216 DOHC coupe -93
Rover 620 ti -98

User avatar
scoobyh123
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Re: Manalishis 820 Vitesse Coupe

Post by scoobyh123 » Wed Aug 29, 2018 10:57 pm

Your best bet is to take it complete to your friendly neighbourhood autoelectrician Henrik. There's very little that can be done unless you have certain pieces of test-gear. These aren't usually available to the "man in the street" and without them you're just guessing.
Cheers,
Dave

'02 Honda CR-V SE Executive
'99 Jag S Type 3.0 V6 SE


Image
'94 827 Sterling saloon
'88 Volvo 760 V6 Estate
'95 827 Coupé LPG gone but not forgotten!

User avatar
Manalishi
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Re: Manalishis 820 Vitesse Coupe

Post by Manalishi » Thu Apr 25, 2019 1:28 pm

Long time since any good updates.

Since many months I have been struggling with really bad back problems. A surgery is closing in and I really dont want to go that way, so I have Done absolutely nothing with any of the cars.

And yesterday disaster struck! Suddenly the temp gauge Rises fast and a hissing noise in the footwell. After a Quick check it is obvious that all the coolant is pouring in.

I dont think I will be able to fix this as it is now but the plan is to rip out the carpet, drying the car out and then plug the Matrix. So question: am I thinking correctly? If I plug the two ingoing hoses in the firewall, The Matrix is sealed off and I can drive the car but without any heater what so ever. Am i thinking correctly?

Then the next step is to get the Matrix out, but from what I understand that is a pig to do...


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Henrik
Rover 820 Vitesse Coupe 180bhp -93 (Italy)
Rover 827 Vitesse manual (non cat) -89 (Spain)
Lexus GS450h -13
Austin Seven Special -36
Gone:
Rover 820 ti -95
Rover 216 DOHC coupe -93
Rover 620 ti -98

User avatar
scoobyh123
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Posts: 12149
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Re: Manalishis 820 Vitesse Coupe

Post by scoobyh123 » Thu Apr 25, 2019 3:59 pm

If you can get a "U" shaped piece of 15mm copper pipe Henrik you can use that to provide the loop for the cooling system. Using a loop means the heater valve will still operate (under the bonnet a short distance from the bulkhead/firewall connections to the matrix) so that it doesn't seize up but you won't get any warmth out of the heater. It will also help prevent airlocks from not circulating the coolant.

I've not had to do an 800 matrix but i've heard it's a long job, the dashboard has to come out (apparently only 6 or 7 bolts but i'm not sure), instruments and so on the reach the heater/air-con box for access to the matrix.

When you do feel up to doing it, the hose from the heater valve goes to the top matrix stub but just a thought - have you checked to make sure it is the matrix itself leaking and not one of the hoses squirting through the bulkhead under pressure because a Jubilee clip has failed on one of the hoses?

COrrect me if i'm wrong but don't you and/or Gunnar have a spares car?
Cheers,
Dave

'02 Honda CR-V SE Executive
'99 Jag S Type 3.0 V6 SE


Image
'94 827 Sterling saloon
'88 Volvo 760 V6 Estate
'95 827 Coupé LPG gone but not forgotten!

User avatar
Manalishi
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Re: Manalishis 820 Vitesse Coupe

Post by Manalishi » Thu Apr 25, 2019 6:13 pm

Thanks Dave!
Yes I need to look closer to see if it is something wrong with hoses or jubilee clips but the hour I could spend today only gave me the chance of getting the drivers seat and carpet out to dry that side.

Yes, we have a spare car so hopefully the Matrix is ok - if needed.
Cheers!
Henrik
Rover 820 Vitesse Coupe 180bhp -93 (Italy)
Rover 827 Vitesse manual (non cat) -89 (Spain)
Lexus GS450h -13
Austin Seven Special -36
Gone:
Rover 820 ti -95
Rover 216 DOHC coupe -93
Rover 620 ti -98

User avatar
scoobyh123
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Posts: 12149
Joined: Sat Jul 11, 2009 10:27 pm
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Re: Manalishis 820 Vitesse Coupe

Post by scoobyh123 » Thu Apr 25, 2019 10:25 pm

I just hope it's something quickly and easily sorted for you Henrik!

I suppose you could use the spares car to practice the removal job on, you might find an easy way of doing it!

Easiest cars i've ever known for heater matrix removal were Mk3,4 and 5 Cortinas (Taunus i think they were called in Europe and Sweden) where once the hoses were removed from it, two screws held a hard rubber end cap in place, remove them and withdraw the matrix! Now imagine that heater matrix next to the wiper motor under the bonnet!

Image

The downside of it was that because the matrix was above the thermostat and radiator, airlocks were comon in the matrix! :shock: :roll: :wink: :D
Cheers,
Dave

'02 Honda CR-V SE Executive
'99 Jag S Type 3.0 V6 SE


Image
'94 827 Sterling saloon
'88 Volvo 760 V6 Estate
'95 827 Coupé LPG gone but not forgotten!

User avatar
Manalishi
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Posts: 2458
Joined: Wed Jun 03, 2009 2:38 pm
Location: Stockholm/Sweden
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Re: Manalishis 820 Vitesse Coupe

Post by Manalishi » Fri Apr 26, 2019 3:22 pm

Yes, the plan is to practice on the donor car. But Im not looking forward to it!
Thanks again Dave. The back is getting better so might even do some elbow Grease on the black Vitesse later on!
Henrik
Rover 820 Vitesse Coupe 180bhp -93 (Italy)
Rover 827 Vitesse manual (non cat) -89 (Spain)
Lexus GS450h -13
Austin Seven Special -36
Gone:
Rover 820 ti -95
Rover 216 DOHC coupe -93
Rover 620 ti -98

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